The Gary Null Show with Dr. Mark Geier, 10-23-09

The Gary Null Show, 10-23-09, An in depth discussion of vaccines, vaccine fraud, thimerosal & the two influenza vaccines with Dr. Mark Geier, medical physician, PhD in genetics, former researcher at NIH; expert on thimerosal, vaccine research, and vaccine injury.

Gary Null: But, of course the most important information, at least if you live in New York State is some good information, some good news that has just happened, last night. (Handel's Hallelujah Chorus) Yah, (Gary chuckles) we won one. Last night, the Governor of New York State, Governor Patterson, and I'm assuming in close, ah, close communication with his Commissioner of Health and others decided to not make the Swine Flu vaccine mandatory for the health care workers, the majority of health care workers in New York State.

That's the battle we've been fighting. Now, they gave their reason which was a shortage of Swine Flu [vaccine]. I do not accept that nor does anyone else (end Hallelujah Chorus music) who has a brain because there has been no shortage of the Swine Flu [vaccine] based upon the amount of people who are mandated to get it. Ah, what I do believe is, ah, the real reason, and I want to thank the people in this audience, is that there has been a massive push-back by the American public. In fact, all over the world, in every country people are pushing back. In Germany, ah, the German people are pushing back in massive amounts in England and in France. But in the United States in just the past sixty days there's been a quantum leap in the number of American adults saying they will not take the Swine Flu vaccine because they're concerned about safety and efficacy.

What has happened is that, based upon testimony ah, last week ah, before the ah, Oversight Committee in the State of New York, ah, some extremely intense comments and pointed comments made about the flaws within their mandatory vaccine program, a series of articles that went viral and millions of people have downloaded them and read them. People are challenging their legislators. Also, there was a rally in New Jersey and a rally in New York, in Albany.

In the rally in New York I took lawyers with me, had them dress in their normal suit and gave each one a copy of a hundred page article on challenging the science behind the vaccines, that they were not safe, proven safe and effective, especially for pregnant women, children, and the elderly. Because they didn't look a, your street protester (they were all in suits, they looked like they were legislators) they didn't have a problem with security and managed to drop off the articles, a total of four articles, to every member of the New York State Legislature directly into their office. We then had mailed every single State Legislature member in America, all fifty states a copy of the article. Plus we mailed every one of the fifty governors a copy of the article. Every member of the Senate, every member of the House of Representatives in Washington a copy of the article. We've had volunteers here mailing from early morning 'till late at night seven days a week for about three weeks. We have mailed out thousands upon thousands of articles. So, for all the people who have written and phoned their protest, for those who have shared, ah, the, ah, from the blogs the articles and testimony, you are the reason that this was dropped. And I want to thank you. And all of us should realize that this was a collective effort. It took many people to decide that it was time to stand up and speak out.

That said, let us now go over and say hello to two guests, standing by, who are going to take us deeper into this topic and to show you information that you did not know otherwise. We have Doctor Mark Geier, G-E-I-E-R. He is a medical doctor and a PhD in Genetics. He is certified by the American Board of Medical Genetics and a Fellow of the American College of Epidemiology. He also was a researcher at the National Institute of Health for ten years. And he has taught at Johns Hopkins University. He has a distinguished career but is considered one of the world's leading experts on thimerosal and vaccine efficacy. He has published dozens of papers on vaccine safety and efficacy and politics and policies and even on Autism in peer-reviewed publications. And he has testified before Congress.

Also [here] is David Geier. David is a, ah, vice-president of the Institute for Chronic Illness. He is Mark Geier's son. He is a researcher. Ah, he has co-authored fifty articles in peer-reviewed papers (sic) [journals]. And ah, he was also at the National Institutes of Health. Nice to have you both with us today. We'll start with ah, you, Doctor Mark Geier.

Doctor Mark Geier: Thank you for having me.

Gary Null: Dr. Geier, the, for a long time we have had this argument and I'm going to give you the full layout and then s-, ah, sit with my audience quietly and allow you to go through and deconstruct the arguments I am putting forward, as if I am the FDA and the CDC. Alright?

Doctor Mark Geier: OK

Gary Null: Here is the arguments.

One, that it's vaccines that have caused, in general, all vaccines that have caused the elimination of major plagues. Plagues such as smallpox and ah, and ah, measles, ahm, whooping cough. And without these vaccines, these plagues would have decimated ah, populations. So we owe the vaccines the, ah, the du-, ah, due reward for stimulating in a positive way, the immune system by creating anti-bodies that would then attack these ah, ah, that would attack these, ah, these pathogens.

Number two, that the vaccines had been created under the strictest of scientific principles and they had passed FDA approval because they are proven safe and effective. And the FDA would never, nor would the CDC put the public at risk, (especially the public that's most vulnerable, pregnant women and children and infants, babies at risk. After all, within an hour of being born babies receive a hepatitis B vaccine) if it were not safe.

[3] That thimerosal is an absolutely necessary addejant to potentize these vaccines. And it is safe. In fact, the vast majority of scientific literature shows that the mercury in the vaccines, thimerosal, is safe. And there are no studies showing a connection between thimerosal and any neurological damage, including Autism. That every major medical organization, the American Academy of Pediatrics, the FDA, the AMA, ah, the ah, CDC, all agree that thimerosal is safe. And it was only withdrawn voluntarily to appease those who were alarmists, but otherwise it would still be there today and is still in the Swine Flu vaccine at 23 to 25 micrograms and in the regular seasonal flu vaccines.

[4] And finally, that we're facing a pandemic, a pandemic that can be the next major scourge similar to the ah, major ah, flu epidemic at the beginning of the century. And that we're not [dog barks] going to put people at risk because there are people who believe that there might be some problem. That the new pandemic has caused the finest scientific minds in the world to gather together and to create vaccines for the Swine Flu vaccine (sic). And then also, with the regular flu vaccine to protect people. And we're going to protect those who are most ah, challenged first, pregnant women, children and the elderly. And anyone who challenges this is coming from an unscientific position. We have double-blind, randomized, placebo-controlled studies, dozens of them, showing safety and efficacy. So, therefore, anyone, whether it's scientist or lay person that challenges this program is irresponsible in the extreme and should not be taken seriously by the media. And indeed, the American media has not taken any of the challenges, and at no point today did the New York media even mention that there were a massive public outcry with enormous ah, challenge on the scientific basis. That's the argument. Take your time. You'll not be interrupted. And lay out your deconstruction of those points.

Doctor Mark Geier: It's a very complex issue. And let me start out by saying, probably much to you, and maybe your listener's ah, surprise, I'm not anti-vaccine. I, I, I don't, even though I'm often accused of being one of the leaders of the anti-vaccine movement, I'm not anti-vaccine. I've spent many years working on vaccines. I am, however, anti-, ah, inappropriate use of vaccines and also putting dangerous things into vaccines. Ahm, I believe, ah, to answer the beginning part of your ah, comments, that although many of the pandemics or many of the bad diseases that we had were already declining due to better public health. I believe that, that vaccines did indeed wipeout smallpox. They do lower whooping cough and they do ah, lower the amount of measles. That being said, there are some major, major problems with our public health.

The first problem is that the public health oddly enough, does not believe that they need to tell the truth! There are a lot of people in the world that don't tell the truth. But these people actually believe it's their job not to tell the truth. And so, as you pointed out, one of the big ah, things that they continually say, they, they boiled it down to two, two major lies. One of them is that thimerosal is out of all the vaccines. And that is certainly not true. Ah, it was removed from some childhood vaccines, ah, and it was replaced by influenza vaccine with full dose thimerosal, which was never given to children or pregnant women. The total ah, thimerosal, which, ah, ah, if anybody is not familiar, is a mercury-containing compound in the vaccine schedule as it's recommended today, is about three times as much as it was in 1999 when they said they were going to remove it! This can be seen by simply going to their website and adding up, they don't think you can add, but if you add up, they now recommend influenza vaccine to every pregnant woman, both types. Both of which would have 23, as you say, to 25 micrograms of mercury. They recommend two shots in the first year of life, ah, for influenza and one shot, all the way through ah, age 24, every year! That's more, ah, thimerosal than there was ever before.

The other lie they tell is that there are no peer-reviewed articles that link thimerosal to either Autism or to other neuro-developmental or other problems. This is a total lie. And any, any, ah, ahm, reader can confirm this simply by going on line to Pub-Med, which is the National Library of Medicine and type in the word "thimerosal". It changes daily, but you'll get over fifteen hundred articles, almost all of whom talk about the dangers. In fact, it's hardly a week goes by that there isn't another major medical center publishing a major article linking thimerosal to problems.

Ah, since you're in New York, ah, the most recent New York State, ah, ahm, article on this comes from New York State University who published an a ah, article, a peer-reviewed publication about a month ago that said that children who took hepatitis B with thimerosal, one single shot, approximately tripled their rate of Autism! This is not a quack university. This is New York State University.

Ahm, more recently, just to stay in New York, Purdue University just published a modeling system which shows that the H1N1 (they are certainly not anti-vaccine) the H1N1 model ah, ah, for the ah, pandemic shows that if you don't give the vaccine by last week you will miss 93% of the people. You will have at most a 6% efficacy!

Ah, I am actually on line to give the vaccine. I don't have any [10-23-09]. The vaccine won't be available to, 'till, generally available 'till the end of November. By that time there's almost no benefit whatsoever, even if the stuff works! So, ah, in addition, ah, to the, ah, other problems, they, they've messed up their own program and there's virtually no benefit to it.

Now, the next issue is about the FDA and approval. Ah, as you're probably aware, there are two federal [law]suits. You have one and we have one. We've been working on ours for many years and our [law]suit asks the FDA to simply follow the law. And the law says that they have to either show that thimerosal as, as a preservative is safe at, at high doses. You have to prove it at much higher dose than they use. Or that we should have it removed from all medicines and all vaccines, because don't get the idea that it's only in vaccines. It's also in some of the over the counters [OTC drugs]. It's also in ear drops and eye drops and all kinds of other things.

And there, ah, there's a law. The FDA law says that they must show this by, by, ah, ah, you know, complicated, carefully done studies. And their answer, that they filed, is they have no studies, they're no sure what studies mean, (sounds like ah, somebody else we heard that doesn't know what the word the means) they don't know what safety means. And therefore, they have declared them safe. So, we, we are going along with that lawsuit to get them to ban, to, to do their job.

Now, we've asked for an injunction against giving ah, at least mercury-containing vaccines to pregnant women because they're the most vulnerable among us. And the, if you read the, the package insert on any influenza vaccine, either H1N1 or regular vaccine, you will find that the, ah, influenza vaccine is a Pregnancy Class C drug. Pregnancy Class C, see, I'm a practicing physician. Practicing physicians have a problem. On any medicine or any vaccine if we have a pregnant person, (and that's what I work with mostly or largely, is pregnant women and young children,) we need to know whether we can use the drug or not. So the FDA came up with a star-, series of classes. Class C means that there has been no testing and you can only use it on an individual basis or, ah, ah, ah emergency. You can't recommend this for general use.

And the FDA in their answer to our [law]suit says, in fact, they agree with that. In fact, they don't recommend ah, giving ah, ah, pregnant women influenza vaccine. However, they, ah, ah, agree that they are aware that their sister organization, the CDC, and the American Academy of Pediatrics, and the American College of OBGYN do recommend it. And the, the purpose of our injunction request is to simply tell the FDA to go and do their job, to enforce this. Because we're not just suing the FDA, we're suing the HJFF. And they refused to do this.

Now, actually, if you go to the, the CDC website you will see clear hints on there that they don't think that women ought to have the thimerosal-containing vaccines. It says things like, 'well, you know we make some thimerosal-free for pregnant women and, and young children.' But they don't make any attempt to tell anybody who's giving the vaccines about this. So, the judge asked us to do, like a survey. And we went to different ah, places that are giving, so far, the, the regular flu [vaccine] and they don't have a clue that they're not supposed to give the mercury-containing vaccine to, to ah, pregnant women.

Additionally, there's another problem with pregnant women, which is, a lot of them don't know they're pregnant. So, we actually are asking that thimerosal-, ah, -free vaccines be given to any woman who is pregnant or of pregnancy age. Now, the FDA, or the CDC, recommends ah, this vaccine for all pregnant women but they've now withdrawn, at least to some extent and said 'well they really think you should give it in the second and third trimester and not the first trimester.' Well, I can tell you as a person who's worked in the OBGYN field for a lot of years, most people in the first trimester don't know they're in the first trimester. So, [chuckles] they're going to get a, a whole lotta dose.

Thimerosal has been linked to all sorts of things in numerous peer-reviewed publications, but in addition, ah, some of which were published by me, but were published by ah, many, many sources, I would like to review just a few of them. Ahm, Harvard University did autopsies on children who died, who had Autism and died of other causes compared to normal children. And they looked in their brains. And what did they find? High levels of mercury in the area where ah, ah, ah, Autism is caused.

Ahm, Colombia University has a mouse model, Natty Horning's ah, study where she gives ah, doses calibrated down to the size of mice and in susceptible strains, they get Autism. There are now, ah, monkey studies that show the same thing. There are other mice studies that show the same thing. There are hamster studies that show the same thing. There are rat studies that show the same thing. Additionally, there is a very simple way to measure the body's burden of mercury. It's true that if you take an Autistic child and you look in their urine, they don't have any mercury because the mercury is bound into the body, unless they got the shot recently.

But there is a long-accepted method called urinary porphyrin. Urinary porphyrins have been applied to mercury spills, to dentists, to anybody who works with mercury and they reflect, there's a pattern of merc-, of, of urinary porphyrins that reflect mercury toxicity in the body. We studied mercury, ah, the urinary ah, mercury pattern and we found that the more ah, mercury toxic the, the studies show, the worse the, the children are. That if they had a little bit of mercury toxicity, they had a little bit of Autism. If they had more mercury toxicity, they had more Autism. We published three or four studies. Ok, they don't like us. So, ah, Phillipe August has studied it in Europe. And they found exactly the same thing. Ah, there's a group in Australia, one of the big Australian Universities, David Austes has done it and he has found the same thing. There is a University, it hasn't come out yet, it's coming out in South Korea and they did it and they found the same thing. The CDC has no answer to these, these, these biochemical studies.

Additionally, we find that, we and everybody who, who bothers to look finds that almost every Autistic child has low glutathione. Here's the answer to the, ah, the question. The CDC tries to fool you. They say, "Doctor Geier, you know, if everybody, if the vaccines cause Autism and everybody got the vaccine, how come they all don't have Autism?' Good, good question, huh? If, if smoking causes ah, lung cancer then how come everybody who smokes doesn't have lung cancer? Well, the answer to both is susceptibility. And nobody knows what the susceptibility is to lung cancer.

But we know what the susceptibility is of several of them is to, to ah, mercury. If you have low glutathione, as these kids do, 'cause you can measure them. And you can measure them in lab core. Ah, then they're the ones that get the Autism. In addition to having low glutathione, incidentally, they have high testosterone. Ah, and, and, as, as the glutathione goes down, the testosterone goes up. And when you get mercury toxic, your testosterone goes up. And in fact, in mercury poisoning, ah, it makes people, not only ah, ah, damages the brain, but makes them aggressive. The current Autism epidemic is an epidemic of aggression.

'It began in 1990.' Gee, that's just the time when we tripled the amount of mercury in the vaccines. Ah, the, the, the, CDC denies an epidemic. They can't have an epidemic because their view is that it's purely genetic, (and I'm a geneticist). There's a genetic component to Autism. There are few genetic causes for a few ra-, ra-, rare ones. The genetic component is that you have ah, changes in your genetic, genotype type which we can measure which make you susceptible to mercury. But you can't have a genetic epidemic. So, when that was pointed out to them, ahm, then, they decided there was no epidemic. Let me tell you the numbers of what's happening in Autism. In 1970 I read a paper that found, that found a remarkably high rate of Autism which had just risen in 1970, to point seven eight per ten thousand. By ah, by 1990 when they started giving the vaccines the CDC finally came out with it's one in a hundred and sixty-six [rate]. They updated that pretty soon to one in a hundred and fifty. This year [2009] they updated it to one in a hundred. But if you want to actually look at the children that were born in the middle 90's when they gave the most mercury and you look at the boys, it's around one in twenty to one in thirty! Heh, that's the greatest epidemic in history!

Uhm, I testified and worked with a Congressional Committee, ahm, which is the ahm, Government Reform Committee. They did three and a half years of Hearings and they came out with a formal Congressional Report. The report says, and it was signed by both sides, Democrats and Republicans. The report says that after all, 'hearing all sides of this issue it is clear to the Committee that thimerosal in the vaccines caused the Autism and our,' (this is the quote from the report) 'our public health officials are guilty of,' quote, 'institutional malfeasance in covering it up.' Pretty strong statement and, in fact, you might think there is just a scientific dispute here, but there's no scientific dispute! (clears throat three times) The other side of this issue clearly notes, knows what caused it and I, I have ten thousand pages of documents that I got from Congress that I'm allowed to share that show it.

But if you don't want to look at 10,000 pages simply go on line and, and type in "Simpsonwood transcript" because our public health officials met in 1999, in the summer of 1999 at a place called Simpsonwood, Georgia in an illegal meeting. It was illegal because they met with the industry without making it open and notifying Congress. We do have Sunshine laws and they, but they kept a transcript. And the transcript says 'we know it's the thimerosal. What are we going to do about it?' And the other, the other person there says, 'I think it's too late, we'll never be able to cover this up.' And the other person says, 'Well, I'm going to make sure my grandson isn't injected' but were not going to tell anyone else about this. Now, it's clear that they know. Additionally, this one study, and they only have one study, actually, done in the United States that purports not to show the association between the amount of mercury in the vaccines and Autism which was published in Pediatrics, ahm, i-, i-, is, it was a manipulated study which was discussed at that meeting. And we have the memos where they say, 'anyone else think of a way we can change it? I tried that one and it doesn't work. The effect keeps coming back. Let's try something else.'

This has clearly been manipulated. And the reason that they manipulate, to give them some justification, it's their view that if the public were to really realize what they have done as far as causing Autism and other disorders, they wouldn't take the vaccines! I don't believe that, by the way. I believe that none of us want our children to die of infectious disease. That what they should do is they should admit what they did, say they're fixing it, and say they'll try to help the children. And by the way, there are, we have numerous memos in the FDA, in the CDC who agreed to that. And they had a big fight, but they lost.

So, every time a new study comes out, and it's about once a week, (laughs) the authors often call us and say, 'wait 'till public health reads our study. They will then be convinced.' Well, I tell them they will not be convinced. And they say, 'well, how do you know?' And I say, 'there's one group of people that you can't convince. And that is somebody who already knows and has made the decision not to tell the truth. Public health has a thing called risk communication. They actually train their people to lie. And their justification is they have to lie to you so you'll do what's good for you.

Let me give you an example that's very relevant to the influenza vaccine issue. Every year you hear from them that there are 36,000 Americans that die from influenza. We've all heard this multiple times. Occasionally, they say 58,000. But usually they say 38-, thirty-six thousand. This turns out to be an inconvenient lie now because if 36,000 Americans die of influenza in an average year and the, the flu season is, say, six months. That means that six thousand die a month. There are thirty days a month. That means 200 Americans in the average flu season, according to them, die each day. And that, they want us to be very upset about the H1N1 when they got a handful of deaths! So, all of a sudden it came back to bite them. But let me assure you. 36,000 Americans do not die. And I have the, the data on this. And I've published it. And ah, the New England Journal has published it, and numerous other people have published it. The average number of people who die of influenza from the death certificates from 1979 to 2001 is 1260. That's not 36,000. And, and we actually have a, ah, tape, I think it was News Fox 6 caught them on tape saying 36,000. They said it was by death certificates. We showed them the death certificates and they said, 'well, yah, it's complicated. As a matter of fact, it's a model. It's not based on death. It's based on how many people die in the summertime and how many people die in the wintertime. And it's been known for a long time that more people die in the wintertime than the summertime. So, they subtract the two. Hence, 36,000. The trouble is there are 600 other viruses that can cause death. The other problem is there are all kinds of reasons that you die.

Just yesterday [10-22-09] they came out, the CDC came out with one in five children now, by survey, have a flu-like illness. That, I don't know if the survey is right or not but H1N1 is not a flu-like illness. The flu is not a flu-like illness. You have to show that you have the flu in order to, to know you have the flu because it can be any one of hundreds of other viruses and bacteria and other infection! Additionally, if you show you have the flu, you have to show it's H1N1. They're not testing. And I know this personally because I'm on the Executive Committee of the Montgomery County Medical Society which is the, ah, most powerful medical society in Maryland. And we met with, I sit on, on the board along with public health. And public health came in and quite surprisingly said don't send us any more blood. Any body who has a temperature of 100.0º and a cough we're going to count them as having Swine Flu!

Gary Null: (interrupting) That's a fraud.

Doctor Mark Geier: This is ridiculous!

Gary Null: (interrupting) That's a fraud.

Doctor Mark Geier: One hundred point zero is not even a fever! You know?

Gary Null: It could come from, ah, any source.

Doctor Mark Geier: Absolutely. Any source. So, they're counting people who don't have the flu. And now there are several publications that show that most of the flu-like illnesses, of course, are not flu. And of the ones that are flu, they're mostly, ah, not H1N1. And you understand a vaccine, a flu vaccine cannot work against a flu-like illness! It may not even work against the flu because it may be against the wrong strain! And, and let me point out that 50% of the time they get the wrong strain because they have to guess. And again, I have the data on that. But even if they get the right strain, it's not clear that it works.

And what's happening now, the really immoral, inappropriate thing that's happening to people now, even people in WHO are upset about this. They're now giving H1N1 vaccine that they have done no testing what so ever! No safety testing. No efficacy testing. They're, they, the reason what they gave to the FDA to get it passed was they said, 'last year's flu was safe,' the flu vaccine was safe so you should give this one safe.' It's a totally different strain! One of them can be safe, one of them can not be safe. There's absolutely no efficacy studies whatsoever! And U.S. law requires efficacy studies.

And in fact, interestingly enough, you're in New York State. New York requires that there be no thimerosal in the vaccines. Ah, we, we went around and had seven states pass that. 'Well, it's, it's an emergency.' So, they're going to use it anyway. Even though your state agrees with us that thimerosal should not be in vaccines. Now, thimerosal, unfortunately does not just cause Autism which, incidentally is, to put into perspective, what we're talking about in Autism, readers who do not or listeners who do not have an Autistic child, the numbers that we're talking about, now, the estimated damage from the Autism epidemic by the U.S. Congress is twenty trillion, that's with a "t," not a "b," 't' dollars. That's more money that World War One and Two combined!

Our school systems are full of these children. And you know what happens when they get to be eighteen? They come out of the school system. Now what are we going to do with them? Many, if not most, will need some kind of institutionalized care, either full-time, or part way. I don't see anybody building institutions. These kids are not the rainman, for those who haven't seen it. These kids are not the rainman. These kids are mostly highly aggressive. Fifty percent or more have no words. They, they break their mother's arms. They throw things. They break every window in the house. They bite themselves. What are we going to do with these kids? And when are we going to stop making them?

It is immoral and inappropriate that we give a vaccine that has not been tested. It is a violation of not only of U.S. law but of the Geneva Convention which says that you cannot test, cannot give people untested drugs, or, or vaccines without getting permission. You have to tell them that it's an experiment. They are experimenting. I've just read some of their articles now. 'This is a great situation' they say. 'We can find out what happens'. They're experimenting on the American population. Now, all that being said, as a person in genetics who believes in, in informed consent, I think you can have informed consent. But when you tell people that 'you have to take the vaccine or you're going to lose your license to practice,' ah, you know, 'health care in New York State.' That's not informed consent! When you try to tell people that their kids can't go to school because they don't take the vaccine, that's not informed consent!

And, by the way, it's also not true. In 48, ah, in 50 states in the United States there's a medical exemption. In 48 states, (the two states missing are Mississippi and West Virginia,) there is a religious objection. That means if you don't believe in it, you don't have to do it. And in 22 states there's a philosophical objection. And you can object to one particular vaccine. And they know that and again I go on to meetings and they present it. They recognize that right. But they think if they hide it, more, more people will not use the right. You have the right to make your own decision.

Now the other problem with, with ah, mercury in the vaccines and some of the other vaccines is, what else does it do? Well, if you look up what, what ah, mercury does, it causes ah, cancer. It causes birth defects. It causes abortion. I mean, we don't even have a good way of knowing what the effect of, on children who have the thimerosal-containing vaccines, what it's going to do to them, 20, 30, 40, 50 years from now. Also, there's a big implication that, that mercury toxicity is involved in Alzheimer's disease. It's almost certainly involved in the, the other epidemic diseases that are occurring right now.

And let me point out something to your listeners. This country is very low on infectious disease. We've done a great job. I take my hat off to the vaccines. I don't think it's totally vaccine, but I think they've helped.

Gary Null: (interrupting) You and I share a difference of opinion on that, sir but that is not for us to debate today. I will give you a pass. But on another occasion you and I will debate the issue.

Doctor Mark Geier: There is…. But, but, but, let me point out another thing, which is, we have a much bigger problem to debate than whether it's the vaccines or not. The problem we have is that a child born in the United States today has a greater than 50% chance of having a chronic disease in the first ten years of life. The chronic diseases are, ah, Autism, ADHD, which is caused by, again, the same thing, mercury. Ah, something like a third of our children are taking Ritalin in school. What is going to happen to us when these kids come out of school? Then, then, in addition to that there's an obesity epidemic and there's an asthma epidemic. When you add those up, over one half of the children in the United States has a chronic illness. This is a very major problem. The CDC doesn't understand the word "illness" ah, "disease" unless it is preceded by the word infectious! There are other diseases. They're called chronic illnesses. And chronic illnesses cause a great deal of trouble too. And it's very clear that, that we're causing problems.

And the vaccines need to be used in an intelligent way. I mean, giving hepatitis B on the day of birth to someone whose mother is not hepatitis B-positive makes no sense whatsoever! I mean, it's ridiculous. You want to give hepatitis B [vaccine] to a 16-year-old who's getting involved in sex, come back to me. But you can't give it on the day of birth!

Giving boys, ahm, ah, ah, the HPV vaccine, which, which they claim prevents cervical cancer, which incidentally, it doesn't. They haven't shown that. Ah, they don't have a cervix! I mean, let's use some intelligence in how we use our vaccines.

And giving, the current recommendation for influenza, and this is where the big bucks are. The people have to understand, it's not in childhood vaccines where you take 'em a few times and you're done. The big bucks are in influenza. In influenza they plan to give every single person in this country at least one and probably two influenza vaccines every single year! That's where the big dollars are. Where are the safety studies that you can take an influenza va-[vaccine]. Let's say you were born today and you're going to live 79 years. I think that's the average life span. Ahm, if, if, what's the safety data that you can take 79 influenza vaccines without causing a problem? There's no safety data. You're the guinea pig. This is ridiculous. This stuff has got to stop. We have to stop being lied to by public health. They, they, they believe in lying to us. They think it's necessary. And they will continue to do so. This, all of this has to stop. And they are so many peer-reviewed papers that I, I couldn't, if you gave me a week. And I've done this before.

Ahm, ah, David Dominick of the Autism Commission here in Maryland. And we've presented in Florida. There are so many peer-review .… It's such a big lie. They have virtually no peer-reviewed papers on their side. What they have is opinion. You can get (clears throat) all kinds of pediatricians to give you an opinion that the vaccines are safe. But if you look at actual studies, they have a handful, and there are five, something like five thousand on the other side. And the handful that they have, have all been, have all been shown to be modified in order to protect the vaccine program!

I don't know if I answered all of your things but, I rambled on a while.

Gary Null: You did. No, ….

Doctor Mark Geier: Oh, there is a last one you said about pandemic. By their definition, which is multiple, ah, ah, outbreak in multiple countries. Understand, there will be a pandemic every single year. There has been a pandemic. Flu comes every year. They're all pandemic. And we're going to live under a pandemic emergency just like we live under, you know, you go to the airport, we're under security orange. It's been security orange for eight years or ten years. It's going to be pandemic indefinitely and there's no pandemic. And the trouble with the pandemic, what people don't understand is …. (Who cares whether they call it a pandemic or not?) Oh, it makes a big difference because when you call it a pandemic. Then we lose all our rights! It tilts the bio-shield law. And then they start forcing people. And then it turns out they can probably shoot you or force you with military ah, weapons to take it or to do whatever they want. And we're going to live under a pandemic.

Let me remind people what they forget. Public health has tried to do this every single year for as far back as you can think of. Let's see, last year we had the Bird flu and they got nine billion or something dollars from Congress for the Bird flu. No Bird flu [pandemic]. Before that, let's see, there was SARS and they got nine billion dollars for SARS. No SARS [pandemic]. Oh, the year before that there was West Nile Virus and they got nine billion dollars and no West Nile virus [pandemic]. And, by the way, some Congressmen have called me and asked me what I would do. And I said 'give them the nine billion. I don't care. Just tell 'em, 'don't hurt anybody.' But this year, they're not only are they, are they going after a pandemic that isn't there but they're hurting people. And they're, the reason they are is you can only call 'wolf' so many times. You better, you better start giving it.

And as I said before this began, they're going to claim there are hundreds of millions of people with Swine flu and they're going to claim millions of deaths, whether they occur of not and because they can't be wrong! I was involved in the 1976 Swine flu. And there they told the truth. There was no Swine flu [epidemic]. And there was lots of damage. It isn't going to happen again. This time people are going to 'die of the Swine flu' whether they die of the Swine flu [or not]! And there's going to be millions of cases, whether there are millions of cases [or not]! And they're not even going to look. They don't, they don't want to know. That's where we stand. I think I, I touched on all of your points. I could talk for, I think you can tell.

Gary Null: You did. Well, we're running out of time now. But you did a very good job. And I appreciate your input, Doctor Mark Geier. Let's go over now and say hello to Doctor David Geier, Mark Geier's son who I mentioned his credentials earlier.

The Gary Null Show of 10-23-09 was rebroadcast on KPFK-90.7 FM radio on 11-4-09 at ~4:30 AM.

http://www.somethingshappening.com/ Click to the right of What Happened, "Click here". http://www.virtuallybaroque.com/roh/2009/2009.htm From the calendar select November 4, 2009. Then select the audio icon on the line for "4:00-5:00 Gary Null Program 10-23-09a, " to download the audio of this radio program on RealPlayer. This is the show transcript from 1:21:42 to 1:57:22

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